Q and A Study Version of the King of the North


NOTE: This study is an advance present truth study. If you are not well advanced yet in the Lord’s Rod message, this may be confusing. Nevertheless you are welcome to follow along but if it’s not understood no need to be worried about it.

This week the Lord planted the idea to review the King of the North study. Just a few weeks ago, we had an opportunity to give a live presentation to a small group of present truth believers at our home. But upon reflection we realized that this study has so many twists and turns and is not at all a simple one, we need to focus on a more simplistic version, one where someone could print it out and present it to give a more clear view  based upon Q and A.

On Oct. 16, 2016 we did a report here on this blog entitled ” The King of the North (Daniel Prophecy).” The link can be accessed here —


Additionally we did another post on our other DSDA website about this subject. This is the study we outlined in our live presentation. Yet after going through it to our group, we realized after that it probably wasn’t well understood. The objective did not come through as intended due to the complicated nature of this study. Our other study —


Before we begin, this study is more of an “extra curricular study”. Meaning that due to its very complicated nature (not easily discerned) we present it not in a dogmatic way but rather for your consideration. While we certainly believe in our deductions of who currently is and who will be the King of the North, we respect other ideas. If you find the reasoning very clear after this study by all means use it as a study guide because today we as S.D.A as well as D.S.D.A have quite a few differing opinions.



  1. What particular circumstances or facts qualify to be considered “King of the North and King of the South”?

“After the dividing of Alexander’s dominion, Egypt and Palestine were, as previously seen, ruled first, by the Ptolemies; second, by Pagan Rome (Dan. 11:15, 16); third, by the Dan. 11:22); and fourth, again by the Christians — specifically by Great Britain (Dan. 11:41).

   These are the only historically and prophetically recorded supersessions involving the ancient lands of Egypt and Palestine.  The surrendering of these countries, by one prophetic king to the other, unmistakably identifies “the king of the north” and “the king of the south” from the time of the dividing of Alexander’s empire to the present time, and leaves no room for doubt or for argument .

   Rome’s (the king of the north’s) entering a second time into “the glorious land” (Dan. 11:41), shows that though, as aforementioned it once took the land from the Ptolemies (Dan. 11:16) it later, in 633 A.D., lost it to the Turks, and in 1919 — “in the time of the end” wholly regained it.

   Here is simple proof that in modern times the Mohammedan rulers are in prophecy called the “king of the south,” while England’s kings, along with the disrupted family of Christianized kings whom prophecy says will not cleave one to another (Dan. 2:43), are called “king of the north.”(Tract 12, p. 86-87)

So we see that the King of the North must have “ruled” over the “glorious land” and they must have entered it to take possession. This we see has a historical progression 1) Ptolemies 2) Pagan Rome 3) Rome again (Dan.11:22) 4) Disrupted Christianized kings–specifically Great Britain.

           2. Does the SOP describe who is the King of the North ?

“A Word to the Little Flock,” one of the earliest S.D.A. publications, in which Sister White says: “I saw all that ‘would not receive the mark of the Beast, and of his Image, in their foreheads or in their hands, could not buy or sell. I saw that the number (666) of the Image Beast was made up’.”  — p. 19. “Michael is to stand up at the time that the last power in chap. 11, comes to his end, and none to help him. This power…is brought to view in Rev. 13:11-18. His number is 666.” — pp. 8, 9.

   The above explains that the two-horned beast is the one to whom the number 666 belongs; and that this beast, of “Revelation 13:11-18,” and the “King of the North” of Daniel 11:45, are the same power. Therefore, the nation represented by this particular beast, and the “King of the North,” or the “man” who is to be the head king — of that nation in the time when this “image beast” (the two-horned) enforces the worship of “his image,” whose image is nothing less than the thing he made, are to make a likeness of the religio-political system of the “beast before him” (the leopard-like of Revelation 13:1-10); that is, a likeness of the papal system in the period before the leopard-like beast received his deadly wound.

   As the fulfillment of this prophecy is yet future, we cannot now tell who will then be the head (king of the north) of this prophetic nation (modern Babylon) that is symbolized by the two-horned beast.” (SC, vol.2, no.1, p.8)

This reference is packed with clues. SOP declares that the King of the North is the same as the two-horned beast. Then the Rod makes a more detailed summary. Notice that the King shall also be the “head” of the nation represented by the two-horned beast (USA) and when is this to be? Clearly “..in the time when this “image beast” (the two-horned) enforces the worship of “his image,”. 

This pinpoints the timing of this USA’s role as King of the North. Not before the image is enforced but
“when” it is enforced! Let us not let this escape us as it will be helpful as we proceed. Also the Rod notes that only when the time comes for this enforcement will we know who will be the head (ie. specific leader/king).

           3. Does the Rod differ from the SOP as to who this King is now and in future?

“Since those who asked the questions agree with us that we are now living in the “time of the end,” we need not say more concerning that phase of the subject, but we do need to have them tell us which power at this particular time, in the time of the end, has added “the glorious land” (Palestine), Egypt, and other countries to his empire.  The answer that anyone can give is that Great Britain took these from Turkey and has virtually ruled them ever since. Plainly then, during the time of the end Great Britain is the king of the north and Turkey is the king of the south.” (1 TG, No. 4, p.22)

 “The statement, “He shall come to his end and none shall help him,” implies that someone has been helping him, and the world knows that it has been the United States of America.  We therefore, find ourselves living in between verses 44, and 45 of Daniel eleven.” (1 TG, no. 4, p.23-24)

“While the Ottoman Empire has been shrinking since 1669 A.D., the British Empire has been expanding, and it today rules Egypt and Palestine.  Hence, today Turkey is the king of the south, and Great Britain, the king of the north…

We all know that Great Britain has been helped by the United States of America more than once.  But if we rightly understand this verse, the events of which are but a continuation of those found in verse 44, the king will surely come to his end and none shall help him…

From the study of the eleventh chapter of Daniel, we have learned several positive truths: 1. That the time of the end began in the eighteenth century; 2. That the king of the south is the Ottoman empire; 3. That the king of the north at the present time is Great Britain in particular.” (2 TG, no.7, p.9-10)

We see that the Rod, unlike the SOP, announces who was ( at that time around 1947) the King of the North –Great Britain. SOP showed that the “last power”, the last future King shall be the USA/head of that nation. But the Rod describes that GB leads before that time. So the simple answer is –no, the Rod does not differ from the SOP. Rather It sheds more light as to current events.

          4. Does the Rod identify a transfer of Great Britain to another King of the North prior to the last KON — which is the USA?

   Dan. 11:45 — “And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.”

   The only portion of Daniel 11 yet to be fulfilled is this verse, the last of the chapter, and since these prophecies are made to be understood only when they are being fulfilled or after fulfillment, verse 45 is not as clear as we should like to have it.  Consequently concerning the place of his tabernacles and his end, also as to whether another Christian power shall inherit the title “king of the north” before verse 45 is fulfilled, only time itself will positively portray the whole truth.” (2 TG, no.42, p.27)

No, there is no writings that show an identification of any power after the Rod showed Great Britain as the KON. For one thing as we learned, no other power has “ruled” the glorious land since the Rod established the fact in 1947 of GB. The USA definitely has not ruled the glorious land since then. But let us not be confused , somehow the USA will supersede GB after Michael stands up and will be the final KON, this is why we say this is deep and complicated.

         5. Hasn’t Great Britain been removed as ruler of the glorious land  today? Aren’t the Jews there now the current rulers?

Truly amazing how Inspiration knows the deep things of the world! The leading force (king) behind Great Britain has been for centuries– the Rothschilds. Thus as Rothschilds go so does GB and the Rod showed that GB had the power over the glorious land and still does! As many know this GB family has had the “power of treasures of gold, and silver and over all the precious things of Egypt” (Dan. 11:43)

History shows that in 1917 the Balfour declaration originated from the Rothschilds, they have basically “owned” Israel since then. Behind the surface titles and national declarations lurk GB/Rothschilds. Now, it is not obvious to the surface studier but once we look into it we find the following facts —

Israel land owner ship consists of three entities –the State of Israel, the (JNF)”Jewish National Fund and the Development Authority. An estimated 93 percent of the country’s total land area (excluding the occupied areas of the West Bank and Gaza) is owned by the state or by quasi-state agencies.(www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org). Adding to this is also the Zionist movements within Israel, which is controlled by the Rothschilds as  well. For an excellent video explaining these things see the bottom link.

Of special note private ownership of the land in Israel is only about 10%.

“While private ownership of land is common (mainly in urban areas), most of the land in Israel (over 90% of the land area) is in the ownership of either the State of Israel, the Development Authority (Rashut Hapituakh, רשות הפיתוח) or the Jewish National Fund.” (Wikipedia- Israeli land and property laws).

Further the Rothschilds, as is widely known, are the founders of the current banking systems around the world. The founder father of the family, Mayer Rothschild, started way back in the 1760’s. In fact they are said to have an indirect or direct ownership of nearly all the central banks around the world today including the Federal Reserve. It’s like the old saying–“The Golden Rule–He who owns the gold–rules.”

        6. Why does some present truth believers teach that the current KON is USA? 

We believe that because SOP makes the statement in “Word to the Little Flock” that the “last power” will be the USA/KON, and that the Rod confirms it, we just assume that because we are in the very last days the USA’s time (Rev. 13:11-18) is here. But unfortunately the “whole picture” of all the statements cannot support such idea. GB is still the KON (still ruling Israel) and until she is dethroned, the passage of this title to the USA is still future.

        7. If GB is now King of the North, when does it come to its end?

Zech. 14:2 — “For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.”

“In view of the fact that Jerusalem is to be protected by a wall of fire (Zech. 2:5) while the house of Judah reigns there, it is definite that the battle here described must be fought before the house of Judah is established. In that battle the nations will defeat the rulers of the Promised Land. Then it is that the house of Judah commences to be set up.” (1 TG, no.19, p.3-4)

Ok, let’s really zoom in now.  This very important reference has some key clues. We know that Zech. 14:2 is concerning the time of the final gigantic battle over the glorious land (Israel). It is AT THIS TIME  that GB/Rothschilds comes to their end! She will no longer rule the Promised Land. “Then it is that the house of Judah commences to be set up.”

Now we can review previous Inspired statements.

Plainly then, during the time of the end Great Britain is the king of the north and Turkey is the king of the south.” (1 TG, No. 4, p.22)

“..the nation represented by this particular beast, and the “King of the North,” or the “man” who is to be the head king — of that nation in the time when this “image beast” (the two-horned) enforces the worship of “his image,..” (SC, vol.2, no.1, p.8)

So adding it all up we see that GB comes to her end at the gigantic war, and then the USA/KON comes on the scene “in the time when this “image beast” (the two-horned) enforces the worship pf “his image”..

In other words GB is dethroned at the gigantic war and subsequently the USA is  the final KON per Inspiration’s prophetic fulfillment. let us keep clearly in min d that the Rod gives only one solid time setting as to when the USA/KON will be in power — in the time of enforcement of the image and that cannot be until after Ezek. 9 church judgment.

         8. If USA takes over as KON from GB, how is she to “rule” the glorious land, if the house of Judah is established there?

We have to admit that is a true puzzle. The only explanation we can come up with is that the final KON has a waiver of the “rule” requirement as a secondary application. We just don’t really know and as the Rod says, “..only time itself will positively portray the whole truth.” (2 TG, no. 42, p.27)

We would like to offer some ideas about this complex situation. From looking at this from a whole perspective we see a double application of Daniel 11:45. Let us remember that double applications are a well-known Biblical usage. For instance let us look at Peter in Acts.

“But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day. But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh:

and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy: And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke: The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come.” (Acts 2:14-20)

Today we can clearly see that although Peter said those true words, we know that the primary application of Joel is yet future. During his time the Spirit was not poured out upon all flesh (but a small number among the vast amount of unbelieving Jews) nor was the sun turned into darkness and the moon into blood. Neither was this time right before the “great and notable day of the Lord.” But to those who were in the hearing of Peter it was — truth.

So SOP’s application of the KON being USA, should be viewed as secondary and the Rod’s view as primary. GB fits the true application (power of treasuries, ruling the glorious land, coming to his end in Zech.14:2 war, etc.).

We as present truth believers know also that SOP did not have the full light on another important event–Ezek. 9. The Rod places it before the Loud Cry as the primary application and SOP places it during the seven last plagues secondarily.

Closing summary —  As we promised this study is complicated. Yet if we set all the information before us we can see a clearer picture. The King of the North  –GB/Rothschilds  are just about to come to their end. The world’s financial system will collapse and thus the Rothschilds will no longer be “king” nor have any more rulership of the glorious land. Then the new focus will be the worlds religions.

Think about it, a gigantic war over Israel, and GB/Rothschild’s zionist baby is demolished to a large degree. And at this time a shocking event happens world-wide within the Seventh-day Adventist churches (see Tract 14, p.22). Will this not shock and awe the whole world? Will this turn the world’s focus apart from money/riches to God? Of course!

Then the USA backed by the 666 man and the false prophet shall set up to fill this vacuum. But even more importantly the 144,000 take the scene and Joel’s prophecy comes into FULL primary application! The “Great Controversy” indeed!

“No one by beginning to study a subject from the middle, backward or forward, can learn its continuity and know what it is all about. If one is to learn the full truth of a subject, he must study it in its entirety.” (TG, vol. 1, no. 5, p.3)

Oh what a time to be alive! All these things are about to take place.




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